Mar 7, 2020

How We're All Natural Born Entrepreneurs – with Kate Tyshchenko

Show Notes

Success and failure are two facets of the same coin. And no one experiences the thrill of the highs and the anguish of the lows like startup founders do.

In today’s episode we speak with Kate Tyshchenko, founder of Good Cup Project, who shares her riveting story immigrating from Russia to Canada, working within management consulting, and venturing out to impact change.

Kate, graduated with a masters in economics from the University of Regina, & after gaining invaluable experience working for 3 years, she decided to take the leap into entrepreneurship focusing on problems that were present in her day to day life.

Three business ventures in and Kate created The Good Cup Project, a reusable travel mug with built in utensils. The Good Cup aims to lessen plastic waste and for people to live a more conscientious and eco friendly lifestyle.

Kate also reveals the ups and downs of being a solo entrepreneur, the challenges she faced, while rising above the naysayers and the critics.

Follow her journey at


Adrian Grobelny [00:00:00] Today, we have the pleasure of hosting founder and CEO of the Good Cop Project, Kate Timoshenko. Upon graduating with a Masters in economics from the University of Regina, Kate emigrated from Russia to Canada to fulfill her dream of being a successful management consultant. After gaining invaluable experience, working for three years, Kate decided to take a leap into entrepreneurship, focusing on problems that were present in her day to day life. Three business ventures in and Kate created the Good Cut project, a reasonable travel mug with built and utensils. The good cop aims to lessen the waste of plastic and to give people a tool to live a more conscientious and eco friendly lifestyle. 

Jed Tabernero [00:00:58] Hey, this is things have changed, 

Shikher Bhandary [00:01:00] your host, Jessica and Adrian are just trying to figure it out, including this intro, 

Adrian Grobelny [00:01:07] we meet Pioneer's breakdown topics and have a laugh. Welcome to the conversation. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:01:15] They were like few waves of immigration from Russia by this young, highly educated people, so I probably got about 20 years old. Putin became president for like whatever like 50 tense time. And many people started saying, like, OK, you know, it's a dictatorship. Now it's time to leave. I think I I went and I Googled like work and I basically like immigrate. And since I spoke English, I decided I don't want to learn another language. I, I found out that Canada has the simplest immigration policy and what they did. Dennis, I actually Googled like cheaper, cheaper schools in Canada and I found this one school. I'm not going to call the name I applied. And basically I didn't get them, but I already told everyone in my office, like, well, I'm going to Canada. And then I had to come back and be like, actually, I'm not going to move this year. So you'll have to tolerate me for another year. And then next year I applied to more schools and I did get into into a few. So I picked this one schools in the middle of Canada, in Saskatchewan, winters there are terrible. So I came with was, I think, fall. I did not like I did not Bucharest. And when I just like came in, I'm like, oh, I'm going to just find them. They are being B so I couldn't find their B B, I had to ask one of the professors there to let me stay for like a week in their basement, but it was super nice of her. She was from Ukraine. She actually said like, OK, you can do this just because like I know like you already done all this journey, like I'll allow you to do that. So, yeah, basically, I started with my master's in Canada in economics, you know, but not really like economics at first. But then I got super amazing supervisor who, like we worked on the research together. It was it was around mental health. So I really got into like I fell in love with economics, basically graduated and decided, you know, to pursue this what's called like a successful immigrant dream, like I'll get the job with management consulting. Yeah. And I make a lot of money work long hours. So I've done that. I've done that for four years. And I think like I'm a journalist and if you're in management consulting, you still have to like focus on an area. And to me, that's still pretty in there. Like, if I tell you, you'll say maybe it's very broad, but to me it's still very narrow area. Like some people just want to focus on the eye. Some people just want to do financial risk. And that's just a little part of any business. And I just wanted to do it all honestly. I wanted to do operations, finances I and the fundraising, project management, hiring, firing. I decided after three or four years I decided it's time for me to try something on my own. And yeah, that's what I did. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:04:22] A little consulting kind of gives you that platform where you you you're put on certain projects for like two to three months and then you're like, OK, snap out of it and get onto another project. So it could be supply chain stuff one day. It could be like data analysis, another day or so. That kind of helps. And the whole Segway into, OK, you know, I see these companies doing this. I can actually pivot and create my own thing. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:04:48] It is true that at the beginning, as young consultant, you'll do a lot of those things and those will be very, very different projects and you'll learn a lot. But eventually you you'll be asked to like focus on one area. In my case, after two or three years that became financial service industry. So I became someone who just works in risk management in big banks and really knows our data well. So to me, that was already a little bit too narrow. But obviously management consulting does help because it gives you a lot of networking. It gives you this crazy work ethic that, you know, you never stop. You work on weekends, you work on your overnight hours. That's totally the culture. So it it does it does help. Absolutely. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:05:34] Everyone at some point has wanted to be a management consultant because they wanted to travel and wear a suit or whatever and, you know, feel like you're diving into some really complex topics and solving problems. 

Jed Tabernero [00:05:49] Plus you're coming into an institution and and, you know, basically you're being hired by management to tell them what to do. So, yeah, yeah. It's really cool. I don't know. We've had we so I work in a large financial institution as well. And we have a lot of management consultants. All of the big four work in one office in in San Francisco, for example, we have the big four and separate floors and they're all working on different things. Right. But every time we meet a consultant. A, they want to take us out to drinks, they want to take a look. Yeah. You know, it's relationship. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:06:19] Yeah, yeah, it is. 

Jed Tabernero [00:06:21] And as part of their job, they have budgets to spend on the clients. And for us, since we had all four of the big four, they would compete for our Christmas parties and they would play Jesus. They would plan around the other consultants Christmas parties. Yeah. I mean Adrian has actually yeah. Adrian is actually see me after these parties because I used to live with him when I was when I was still working in that office. But it was an amazing thing because I would meet them and I would well beyond all the free drinks I get. It was a lot of just learning about how they would do things. So in a traditional job, you're actually forced to focus right away. So for me, I went to the financial services and I went to systems analysis and then I went straight to controller. Right. And in the controller ship, it's kind of like focused. You know, you're doing one thing, it's one industry completely that when you're in management consulting, it sounds like you come in and you you start to build frameworks, which is really cool. That was my favorite part of it. Sounds like 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:07:18] from you. 

Jed Tabernero [00:07:18] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So all the problems that you could possibly deal with, you might have had some sort of experience with that. And so it was cool. I really I really respect like that field. It's ridiculously hard. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:07:32] It is. But like when you think about it, all those like trips you take. For instance, I used to travel weekly as a consultant, actually. But the thing is, many people don't understand. You never see anything outside of airport, your own office and hotel, and you get so insanely tired. So it's like, imagine you are just one of their clients, but they would have to, like, take each one of their clients for drinks. That also becomes part of your work, because if you do something like once or twice and then once for fun, it's fine when you do when you have to do it. Absolutely. Like every Wednesday, Thursday, because Friday you have to fly home. Then you do the dry cleaning. You probably catch up with your family, you pack up your stuff and you're back hitting the road. It stops being fun after, I don't know, half a year. But I do know people who've done done that lifestyle for 10, 12 years, and it just shows on them. It shows in their house. 

Jed Tabernero [00:08:31] How is that decision for you? Like, I know it sounds like parts of it were toxic. It started getting boring when you were doing management consulting. How is the transition for you to decide, wait, I'm just going to do all this stuff and get tired anyway, but just pursue my own dreams and do entrepreneurship because entrepreneurship requires, if not the same amount of hours, probably a lot more. And then it's a lot more of ownership on your end because you're not spending the company's money. You are not spending too much money anymore. It's like it's your own money and it's going to be your own time. And you're learning from all these things, not having the structures for those things. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:09:05] Yet all the things that you said to me, they don't sound like a disadvantage. They sound doesn't like, oh, my God, that when they do it, that excites me. So in my case, I have much higher risk tolerance than most people like. Even if you would look at my trade in the country, like, what are you doing? Right. Like I was one of those people who were into Bitcoin on the other side that I bought them. Right. Like you do you you get constant paycheck with your you're selling your time. You're selling your brain to to the extent. Right. So to me was I knew I knew it was something that I really wanted to do. And I think a few years ago, like maybe straight after management consulting, when I got out, I met this guy who actually invented microloans, Muhammad Yunus, I think his name was. And he you 

Jed Tabernero [00:10:01] met Muhammad Yunus. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:10:03] He came to Tronto only for a talk. And he had this one thing which really stayed with me. He said, I don't think people are born to work for companies and corporations. I think we're all naturally born entrepreneurs. And then society kind of pressures you to step out of prison because you're it's easier to manage your right if if you stay in that mindset of like a paycheck home vacation. So I was like, wow, this is really true. But obviously, I don't think everyone should be an entrepreneur because the stress is really, really high. Right. Because it's not just your paycheck dependent on you. It's also other people who who you're hiring. And that's the toughest thing. Like that's why you hear a lot of entrepreneurs who put huge data on their personal credit cards, because you cannot absolutely let yourself not pay for work that has been done by by someone else who has a family to feed me. So that is really, really stressful. Right. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:11:03] So what was your transition into entrepreneurship like? Were you working on a interesting side project while working in management consulting, or did you feel an urge to really drop everything and go all in to starting a business on your own? 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:11:22] If you're management consulting, you really don't have time to work on side projects like I tried it and it's just not possible. So in my case, I was very lucky because I met I met a co-founder. I met someone who also wanted to do it, and they were just straight out of business school. So their choice, like my co-founder choice, was either to go into a typical career, like he was coming out of Harvard. He could either go to, like, I don't know, management consulting or like investment banking. And we met and talked about these things and he said, like, yeah, why don't we because he had nothing to lose yet because he didn't have any established career. And in my case, I also thought I had nothing to lose because, like, well, I was already pretty miserable. Right. Working long hours. So he said, look, yeah, why don't we try to start something? So I just gave my notice and we did have a few ideas we wanted to pursue. So we just started working on it. But I gave my notice. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:12:18] First thing was, was this Kenza? 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:12:21] Yeah. So that was a platform for connecting people like for group dinners, some something like Airbnb of group dinners, marketplace. So yeah. Yeah, that was our first idea. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:12:35] Yeah. That's, that's getting a lot of traction. I know. But if you have seen this new thing that Airbnb has, it's called Airbnb experiences, it's basically you go you visit somewhat like you are in an Airbnb and then they give you experiences, they show you around, they cook dinner for you, they teach you some some like how to make pasta or something like that. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:12:59] So you've mentioned various startups and projects that you've worked on in the past. I wanted to know how do you personally deal with setbacks and hurdles that come up in your business and your team? And how do you maintain a sense of positivity through rough waters 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:13:18] feeling are such a part of this process? I, I don't know. A single entrepreneur could be like, yeah, start the ten companies zero. There are great you know, they're all doing well. It's always like, well I started ten and maybe zero point five or find like like half of this company, this one product we started on the side actually. OK, but there are not there are nine of them are like shut down. But if I were to go back and, you know, knowing what I know now, would I change anything? No, I would still do it in the exact same way, because all that knowledge you gain from from each one of those failures, you'll never get it in any business school. You'll never get like no matter how amazing management consultant you can hire, they won't have that that knowledge. And regarding failure, I get a lot of this startup shame and I call it where people don't really understand why you're struggling and they keep asking you also if you're not successful, isn't it time to, like, quit or the commons on your ideas and products like, wow, this kind of like has been done already. You know, like this people are also doing this like, you know, if you have, like, ideas, which is similar to someone else, which is totally fine, actually it's very rare to find absolutely no market. And if there are no players in that, it's usually a signal that there is no market there. But so I wish people just did all this start the payment to to each other. And the other thing, which is really important and where you kind of touched upon earlier, you said like when you started the podcast, you like you have for three or four of you guys doing this. That's the thing like about having a team. There will be like days when one of you will be like, OK, you know what, like this not this is not really working. We are not getting enough listeners. I kind of want to quit and the other two will support you through that time. Like they will take the burden off your shoulders and you'll keep going. If you're a solo partner, you don't have that team power will take you through this failures and be like, no, no, it's OK. You know what? We can do it. That's why I never suggest anyone to like to do a solo partnership, because it's there are not many successful examples. And even now, wiki, I think, stopped accepting people who are solo partners. At least they stopped investment into the team. Will will ultimately save your break. 

Jed Tabernero [00:15:45] You also at the same time, I think the team is is it's a good dynamic for you to get hash out ideas to check yourself and you're thinking about things. So for me, in the beginning, I was always trying to put something out or send. An email ahead of the approval of my team, and it's always like there's always different opinions within the team. So after we've talked about what I'm supposed to do or the deliverable or the what I have to execute, it becomes a higher quality action right now because all three of us went through it all. We have actually three layers of review. For example, like one, we'll work on it. The other one will have to provide second review and then the third one will provide another review. It's it's a beautiful system so that there's a huge check and balance that the team dynamic is absolutely important. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:16:35] Kate, don't. So he's being really nice about how our approval process is. It isn't that it's friendly. 

Jed Tabernero [00:16:44] It's a I'm I'm a I'm a pretty passive aggressive, though. Is that the right? I I'm an authoritative figure. I feel and I always try to check myself. And, you know, it's a lot of things about the good cop and how you talked about it in certain blogs were pretty interesting because you put a narrative around it. Right. And there was stories that were developed about you. And that's what I learned about you, like being a like working for a detective when you were 13 or whatever. But it was it was it was that blog that I had learned a little bit about you. And during that time you were working on the good cop. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:17:20] I had this idea of just like creating something, you know, nice and neat for people who corner office workers. So I saw I saw a problem first. Right. Like, I I noticed that people in my office and in a lot of other offices, which would like basically where people are not provided like metal cutlery, what they were doing is like they were always going to food courts to grab like a plastic fork. Even if you bring your lunch from home, people would still go downstairs and grab plastic work. I was like, whoa, this is this is crazy. So I thought, why not to design something, you know, like a unique, unique solution and something which would have, you know, a lot of people take coffee away. So some reusable coffee mug, which would have cutlery but hidden somewhere inside. So I started sketching in this case, this mug, which had like little holes in inside of its walls. And basically cutlery like spoon, knife, straw and fork were all fitted like nicely in the like in Moncks Walls. So then I sketched it and I like I sent that sketch to manufacture and they told me like, well, it's not possible to manufacture it because how induction molding works. So I was like, OK, then as an entrepreneur, you start thinking like, what's your next step? Well, you usually find someone who is an expert in the field to help you just finish tweak the design. So I found an engineer who was like an expert in modern instruction. Yeah. And he just helped me to tweak the design. So it actually was possible to manufacture it and to cut the costs of injection molding down. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:19:16] I have to say, when I saw a video of the mug design, I thought it was so clever and well-made, it's just really, really clean looking. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:19:25] Yeah. So I actually never patented it because I thought, well, if someone just used this design, you know, they can just take it. And if they have enough money to manufacture it, they'll be really happy because ultimately we only have one planet. We don't have a plan B in that case. So if if someone has sufficient funds to just, like, launch it, that would be great, because when I basically when I finalized my designs and I received the quote for the minimal order, which manufacturer agreed on it came to about like one hundred gay Canadian. So it's like, what, eighty eight USD. Right. With shipping and taxes and all to just manufacture. I can't remember. It was like five thousand or seven thousand of them, which I was like, well OK, I'll need to allow need to do a Kickstarter first, because this is like every time you're doing some physical physical product, you always face this manufacturing cost, which is a lot. Right. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:20:30] Hardware is is such a hard thing to do because you need a scale. Right. You need to make margins. Consumers don't hurt. You want to pay. It's getting people to buy it. You it's so many different parameters 

Jed Tabernero [00:20:46] that you're creating relationships with wholesalers and 

Shikher Bhandary [00:20:48] suppliers 

Jed Tabernero [00:20:49] stores, 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:20:52] which is why actually they call this Kickstarter and there is another one Indiegogo. I think it's great because you got to like see whether people are willing to pay for the product. So you can just post like, whatever like like models you have, like some, you know, pre baked stuff and see if people want to contribute to you. So you kind of get the proof of concept without having to, you know, dump a bunch of money like a hundred thousand dollars. And then you end up with like five marks in your apartment, like, OK, what do I do now? So at least in this case, it helps you to verify your idea before you before you invest a lot of money into manufacturing. 

Jed Tabernero [00:21:32] Yeah, yeah. Imagine just dropping eighty. Yeah. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:21:36] People do it will do it. 

Jed Tabernero [00:21:38] Yeah. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:21:39] But having such a platform like Kickstarter and stuff where you can just fund projects, crowdfunding projects is, is cool. Like yesterday we were playing this game card game exploding kittens. I don't know if it's, it's not really relevant, but that was a Kickstarter project. The founding team, they just sketched a few things and they had this idea and they put it on Kickstarter. And it was the, I think, the largest Kickstarter back project ever. They use that fund and they made the cards. And now it's the number one rated card game on Amazon. So you can see how this is all in the span of like a few years. But the Kickstarter platform gave them that verification that, OK, you know, people are interested in something. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:22:30] Right, which is crazy. Now, one could imagine anything like that ten years ago or I don't know how the Kickstarter is. 

Jed Tabernero [00:22:36] It's interesting how the capital now isn't going through just the big banks anymore. You know, it's it's a totally different economy in which we have VCs. You have people who are willing to invest in such risk also because I mean, that's also a function of the concentration of capital. And having more fun seems to 

Shikher Bhandary [00:22:54] be like there are more VCs than startups. Right. Right. But everyone's starting their own fund. It's like, well, 

Jed Tabernero [00:23:01] what I'm going to start a fundamental investing only tech product. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:23:04] Yeah, that's actually I know that's true. And even more than that, I notice a lot of people who call themselves like, I don't know, startup cultures or they start their accelerators and you're like, so have have you started the startup before? Like, have you run the business? They're like, oh no. I've been in corporate for my entire life. I just want to support startups. You're like, OK, so that's that's very interesting, right. You just have to be really careful of who you're picking as your mentor. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:23:31] Can you dove into the micro plastic issue? I am not too familiar with how they come to be, but I keep hearing more and more about them in the news. And how is the good cop project directly dealing with this issue and preventing micro plastics from polluting our environment? 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:23:52] Yeah, so basically I think, Michael, plastic is like this pieces of like tiny little plastic, which I think what are they, mostly karmas, actually, not from like Fork's or like plastic knives, but from polymer closers that you buy like this cheap fashion. So when you wash it like it washes off, like peeling off these tiny little pieces which go into. Water like rivers and oceans and all that, so I see a problem, and that's my personal opinion, I see a problem with plastic is not really plastic itself, but like how people are mindlessly using it and disposing it right away. So you'd probably laugh about it. But in Russian like nineties would people would wash grocery bags, plastic grocery bags because you could not afford to buy another one. So like you would see, especially if they're colorful people who would just like wash them and keep reusing them for years, just like one one plastic bag. Yeah, that was a thing. I think people react well to monetary incentives. So maybe before, you know, humanity comes up with better material to substitute plastic, we could look we could look into just like how would society react if you had to pay like three dollars for each plastic straw that you want to dispose? Right. Well, maybe you just buy one metal one and, you know, and use that one for four years. That's kind of like where a good cop is also. So we're trying to substitute something which is like really cheap and really affordable and really, like, easy for you to just grab onto something which ultimately costs that on the 50 or 60 dollars. Right. The good cop itself. For me, it's very hard for me to sell it to people like to substitute something which is free right now, which is like a plastic thing. You don't have to wash it. You don't have to worry about taking. It was just there. And humans are not really rational. Like we don't want to invest effort where like where we don't have to on this day. I think the solution. We could look at it right now is just starting to touch people for for plastic and then I think we would see immediate response to like people switch. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:26:15] And yeah, the problem is so much more. It's I feel it's so much more systemic than that, because if you walk into a gym, you're only seeing people with like athleisure clothes, like the Lululemon, the Nike is the dry fit stuff. And all of that is plastic. All all those clothes are plastic. So when you put it for Wash, you actually have a lot of micro plastics that get into the water. So it's it's going to be such a hard thing for them to sell because everyone wants those clothes. And but there's no end solution as to getting a good enough substitute without polluting the planet. 

Jed Tabernero [00:26:56] How do you think millennials like us can get into help saving the world or help at least alleviating this this problem of micro plastics, or how do we do it beyond using the good cup? 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:27:11] I think we play much bureaus, especially especially young entrepreneurs, because when governments try to deal with, you know, trying to impose some bans or some artificial light, just laws like, OK, let's let's just ban all the plastic grocery plastic bags. And on the federal level right now, let's say in one state. So what we've seen happening is people just switch from plastic bags to like cotton bags, but then they dispose those cotton bags because they feel like, oh, well, this will decompose. Right. And cotton takes so much water to manufacture, it's actually way worse for environment to do that instead of, like, throwing out the plastic bag. But people do start reuse using them as a as disposable ones. Or another thing is like when governments ban those plastic grocery bags, people started buying more garbage bags because what was happening is like you use a grocery bag as your garbage bag and then like, OK, you're out of those. So you have to buy garbage bags and they actually have more plastic in them. So this this bands like, they usually don't work as intended. I think economists call it like negative externality. Right. Because basically we're not really rational. And that's where entrepreneurs come in really nicely, because first you don't have as much market power to, you know, quickly change things and then a downturn comes in. Right. Like you ban something, then you see people reacted in this unexpected, crazy way and you problem became even worse. Entrepreneurs can really be creative, you know, and find this unique solutions to smaller problems at the beginning because they don't have enough funds. But that's what we do need. We don't need, like, just one way to solve the problem. It doesn't work that way. Billion people just to change some tiny little things in their lifestyle, like something as small as like a plastic straw. Right. Seven billion times that. That's how it works. I think just 

Shikher Bhandary [00:29:15] hearing all these your whole journey and how you've always had that initiative to to go out there and create something new. What's it been like, at least the culture in Canada with regards to you being an entrepreneur and also being like a woman entrepreneur? Because we have to face the facts. It's it's just such a male dominated ecosystem. That's why we try our best to get as many voices as possible on the show, because some of us, like guys in general just speaking from a personal point of view, we just don't get it. We just don't see how it's the world has shifted just to focus on men and not really women. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:30:04] Canada is honestly it's great from like, well, I guess it depends what you compare it to. Like, we're still not Silicon Valley like we are. There is no as much appreciation of like, oh, this person is doing startup like the this is great. Most like Canada's a little bit more risk averse culture because just historically most of the economy has always been like, you know, selling food and like other natural resources. So it's like people have stable, stable jobs. But I think things are changing right now, especially you see more female entrepreneurs who like who are working on this. I like great ideas because the those problems have never been addressed before, like, let's say some problems with just women have. Right. If you have just male entrepreneurs like you, you guys will never even think of solving those. But was this culture coming? Supporting female entrepreneurs, do you see a lot of new products getting onto the market, which I think is great and a lot of people are becoming more vocal? I think one of major see, I forgot who it was. I was reading recently that basically we stopped investing into startups unless they have at least one woman on the board, which is great. Right, because you will have this different perspective which women bring. And usually startups tend to do much better if you have like both both sides and both opinions presented, female and male. So I think, yeah, things are changing and it's super exciting to see where it's, you know, going to go in next three, five, 10 years. We haven't seen many, like I'm an Eastern European woman entrepreneur, which is even more rare than just a woman entrepreneur. Like, I've never, um, maybe I should Google, but I haven't heard of any self self-made Eastern European female billionaires, especially immigrants like that, just does not really exist. I'll do more research, but like I want to see more of those things happening. Right, because times are changing and it becomes OK to not, you know, just be successful in your, like, raising the family, but actually do a lot of this this other things which are not traditionally thought of as, you know, something women should be doing. But now it's becoming more and more common. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:32:41] I'm going to get off topic and ask what I've been waiting to ask, and that is, how did you get into scuba diving? 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:32:51] Honestly, I think I've tried this first time when I was like 18. Then I went to Egypt with my mom and I like Red Sea is just absolutely amazing. The experience that you have, you know, when you're under the under the water, it's like nothing like basically you would never have that experience anywhere else is just so unique. So I really loved it then fast. Like, I don't know, 10, 15 years. I moved to Canada and I was like, OK, I really want to get certified. So it doesn't take that much time. Actually, I think it took me like a few weekends also. You noticed how how fragile it is and how much they could get plastic and pollution, you know, and how animals are suffering because what we've been doing mindlessly for years. Right. So it makes you want to see that makes you really appreciate the beauty and how and how fragile it is. And it really changed my my perspective. That's why that was probably one of the reasons I actually became so passionate and so worried about plastic pollution. 

Jed Tabernero [00:33:59] It's crazy how that's that's a narrative into your fight for micro plastics. But, yeah, it's it's crazy because in the Philippines, there's a lot of people that I meet whenever I go to the islands who are scuba diving. That's their main reason for being in the Philippines. One, because it's super cheap to get a scuba diving license over there, too. It's because it's the shortest next to Thailand, I think, or something like that. But it's pretty cool. I mean, they're coming from all over the world and they're just like, oh, I want to see the beautiful corals in the Philippines has the probably what the second most populated coral reefs in the world. And it's it's so I've I have done scuba diving, actually, but I've done just diving. And the corals are freaking gorgeous. Right. But what I also see in the Philippines that you see very reverently is all these activities of these people who live in these beautiful places, the locals who haven't learned necessarily how to take care of the natural environment. So there's a lot of bombing still of coral reefs to get the fish. There's still a lot of there's still a lot of stupid things being done, like all these unsustainable methods of getting fish, getting animal wildlife in. What's pushing that is really the the growth of tourism in these areas. There's also the education piece, which is probably another huge thing. We here in the developed world are both educated and have the means to stop what we're doing. But we're not right. The people who are there in the Philippines don't have any education to figure out like what that's doing to the economy. They also don't have the means to do anything about it if everything new. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:35:35] But it's very exciting to see how, like, you know, there are a lot of bloggers right now who are talking about plastic pollution or like in general environmental issues and what you can change in our daily lifestyle to, you know, to make it a little bit better. And on the other hand, if you go on the upside, at least in Canada and you try to like read up on how to do recycling properly, oh, my God, that's so confusing. Like, I really wanted to email them. Like, if. Had more time, just like to help them out, to arrange it better, because in age of Uber, Airbnb, where everything is like one click away, you know, we're used to like things really simplified for us, taking like few seconds. They were able to create this laundry list of and I know you disclose it, then you move on. You'll you'll never figure out how to do recycling if you go with the government website. 

Jed Tabernero [00:36:30] Yeah, definitely should be part of education. I mean, you know, you get all these kids who are going to school who don't know what the heck that is. And I feel like that would be a great thing to add to secondary education. Hey, how do you recycle? How do you become a better human being? Yeah, a sustainability class is something that would be awesome. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:36:45] So how can our listeners support and follow you on your journey with the good cop project and any other future endeavors that you work on? We love to support our own and we want to make sure that our listeners have the resources and education to learn more about sustainability, how they can lessen their carbon footprint and start with the little things on what they can do to basically make the world a cleaner and a better place to live a life. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:37:17] Well, actually, right now, I don't think we touched upon that. I'm working on that and actually comes from my consultant background. So I noticed that there was no lack of unified tests. If you want like I don't know if you guys time out when you want to get into business school, you take to math or like if you want to study engineering, you take Jerry. Still, I know that right now, if you want to get into management consultant, there are like, you know, a bunch of, like, coffee, chatila start out, then you'll do like a lot of cases. So it costs a lot to companies to run those interviews. So I'm working on it with a few other people who are working on climate of consultants, if you want to call it that way. Basically, we want to test people in like in their communication skills, like writing and speaking also like they're analytical thinking skills as well as their psychological profile. And like if you're a team player or if you're a natural leader. So combining the two like a series of like comprehensive scores. And basically it's a like way to simplify it for consulting companies. Just to give you an example, McKinsey gets something like fifty or sixty thousand applications a year. And what you really want to do is only like interview people who who you almost know you'll wind up getting hired. So you want to like you want to, like, clear out like 99 of those 99 percent of the applications right away saying, like, OK, this person is not the right mindset for consulting and then interview this one percent who probably end up getting an offer. So we're just trying to simplify that that process. And to answer your second question, like, how can people follow me? I have I have an Instagram account. It's my last name. It's the Chanko t y s, h, e and K all s so the channel, because that's that's, I guess, the easiest way to connect with me. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:39:27] Awesome. Thank you so much. 

Kate Tyshchenko [00:39:30] No, thank you. Bye. 

Shikher Bhandary [00:39:34] Thanks for listening to things have changed. 

Adrian Grobelny [00:39:37] Be sure to subscribe to never miss an episode and follow us on our Instagram at THC Underscore Pod. 

Jed Tabernero [00:39:44] We're going to see you next time.